x_SOB ([info]x_sob) wrote,
@ 2006-02-25 21:25:00
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New dog
I have a new dog, kind of. With issues...



My step father, Loren, has a sister who's 85ish and going senile. She's been living in another state with a mean husband, two cats and a dog. This year we have been working to get her a divorce and move her out to Oregon with us so that we could help her out. We found her a house just a block away. Someone took her cats, and she wanted her dog to come with her. We didn't know much about it. She had a hard time remembering its name, let alone its breed. One day its an elkhound, the next it's a collie. We didn't know what to expect.

Loren and her (rachel) took a plane down here, and two of lorens sons agreed to drive her car and the dog down. We didn't feel comfortable flying the dog and thought this was best. On the way there they called and said she was doing ok, but was depressed and hadn't eaten. Understandable. We didn't realize the extent of it.

We got a call saying the dog, Callie, had bitten one of the sons. Apparently they tried pulling her out of the back seat by her collar and it slipped and she took off running near a busy street. She was so scared that she hid under the car. When the son tried to pull her out by her legs she turned around and gave him a good nip. Thankfully he kept on pulling and get her back in the car and off the street. I can only imagine the fear running through that poor dogs mind. I get tearing thinking about it.

So anyways they finally got here last night. They pulled into the garage and rachel was so excited to see her dog. Callie was crouching in the back seat and wouldn't get out. When she finally did, if someone as much as looked at her she flopped on her side in submission. She just shook. Thankfully she recognized Rachel after a bit and clung to her.

I thought once with Rachel she'd calm down a bit, and I realize its only been one day, but I've never seen anything like this.

Callie is the most timid, submissive dog I have ever met. She just gets as flat to the ground as she can and quivers. I thought maybe being being calm and assertive would help... let her know that there is a pack leader and she doesn't have to worry.. but if I so much as stand up she freaks. She is too scared to eat treats I give her. She doesn't know what to do with balls or toys.

The kicker, and what made me actually sit down and cry, was when I was trying to calm her nerves she rolled on her belly and peed herself. Twice. I mean, I thought I knew a lot about dogs and dog behavior. I've read so many books and worked with so many dogs but never anything like this. I move so slow, keep a clam voice, dont look at her in the eye, pet her chest not her head... *sigh*

Her fear, I believe, goes well beyond the car incident. I feel she's been abused.

Rachel is unable to care for Callie properly. My mother and I need to bond with this dog to walk it and care for it. I dont know if Callie can do this. I dont know if I can do this. If you know of any good books on submissive/timid dogs, or have advice, I am all ears.

Thank you, -Jesse

P.S. Rachel is convinced that Callie is a Blue Heeler mix. Now, I ask you, does this look like a heeler? No. Id dare say she's pure border collie. Maybe mixed with collie? She's got such a thin face and legs.




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[info]curisquris
2006-02-26 06:35 am UTC (link)
aussie shep maybe?

Well...you're a little short on info - but - Do you know if the dog has any health issues? Neurological problems or eye problems? Does she ever see invisible 'flies' when she's nervous? Or is it just pure shyness?

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[info]x_sob
2006-02-26 06:49 am UTC (link)
She saw a vet before comming out here. She had a fever, and was given antibiotics and it cleared up. Other than that, clean bill of health. She looks like an aussie in that picture I agree, but in real life she's much more slender and pointy. No flies that I have seen.. and she can see well.

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[info]flyingchanges11
2006-02-26 12:17 pm UTC (link)
She sounds like she might be a lot under socialized or abused. I think time and patience will be the winning key. She needs to build some confidence in herself and surroundings. I have a book, I'll have to try and find it in the boxes o' junk around my house that aids in dogs such as this.....




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A few ideas
[info]arlyenwolf
2006-02-28 05:27 am UTC (link)
I fostered a pup that was like this; he was part of an accidental litter by an elderly lab, who happened to be owned by an elderly lady that couldn't get around easily - managing puppies were far beyond her abilities. The pups were shut in a shed with their mom (the mom was allowed out) and saw no humans for their first 3 months. The two that were given to our rescue org. were ok with dogs, but were super fearful of humans, and exhibited all the behaviours that you mentioned.

To socialize the one I took home, I kept him with my own dogs, and fed them and played with them in a group. I did the following routine with the dog on a two meal schedule, to ensure that he was hungry for treats. I would always prepare his food while making 'yummy yummy noises' as though I wanted to eat it myself.

For the first week I would say 'here Neo' in a friendly but calm voice and offer him super yummy treats in a squatting position without making eye contact during the playtime (or X number of times a day), but if he cowered away I would toss them to him before AND after I stood up and then walk away. Second week same deal, but if he still refused to take them from my hand I would just ignore him and give the treat to another dog. Third week he was taking treats from my hand, and I could talk to him in a quiet but friendly voice, and he rapidly progressed to let me scratch his chest. By the fourth week he would let me pet his head and body and groom him, and I was able to start teaching 'sit' using treats.

As for walking on leash, he would of course not walk after me at all, so I would leave a light short leash on him pretty much all the time. I started walking with him on leash in the house and in the yard only, once he would respond to treats and not freak out at the sight of me. Flat collar at first, quick tugs and tongue clicks to keep his attention and clue him into the treats. Of course, lots of praise even for the slightest movement (this was before I knew about clicker training). I would do this only for a few minutes each session, but several times a day. From here I progressed to taking him to Petsmart each weekend as part of the foster program, and at the end of my time with him, he could heel, sit, lay, shake hands, and stay, and was adopted out to a wonderful family.

I understand that probably because this pup was still in the socialization stage it was easier to progress so quickly, but I feel that patience and persistence is the only way to gain her confidence, as flyingchanges11 said. I understand that it is painful to see her pee herself, but I'm sure you've read that even 'happy' dogs will do this if they have fear triggers. Have Rachel and her husband been the only people she has known? Have you tried working with Callie mainly while Rachel is in the room, or play with the cats while in sight of Callie?

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Re: A few ideas
[info]x_sob
2006-02-28 08:19 pm UTC (link)
Thank you for the advice! I should put that I dont live with the dog, but a block down the street. Callie will live with me when rachel passes away. From what rachel told us (and who knows if its right) callie was a small pup who wandered from a litter. While away, the rest of the litter was killed(?). Someone found Callie as a pup and couldn't keep her, so she was given to rachel's husband who doesn't like dogs. Rachel became the owner.

Rachel made a comment that when callie "acted up" "he just yelled at her and she behaved". that made me cringe. So I do agree that he may have physically abused the dog. Maybe even to hurt rachel.

I haven't found food that she likes yet as treats. She'll take chicken breaste, but we are running out of it lol! She didn't tuch her KONG toy with peanut butter in it. But she wont touch anything at all for that matter. I assume she's been scolded in the past for picking things up.

Its interesting, I went on a walk with rachel and callie the other day. I walked callie on a shorter leash. She walked ahead of both of us and had her tail semi high and wagging. I didn't feel it was the right time to teach her leash manners, but instead let her pull me around. When there was leash slack she would look at me to make sure I was still there and I had to say it was ok.

I toss her treats, but shes so intense on looking anywhere but my direction that she doesn't see the treats being tossed to her half the time. I will keep at that though.

Sorry I kind of rammbled on to you there. Thanks again for your input :)

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Re: A few ideas
[info]arlyenwolf
2006-03-02 04:12 am UTC (link)
Have you tried these?
Dog Food Rolls
I cut them up in any size, freeze the rest, and keep the bits in a ziplock bag to prevent molding during the week until they run out and I need to cut up more. They're easier to manage than hot dogs or chicken breasts it seems, but it is up to the dog to decide which they prefer.
If Callie doesn't see the treats, maybe giving them during the walk and whenever she's in a 'neutral' state would help things; maybe if she's in a more positive state of mind she'll be more accepting.

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[info]dontpraythatway
2006-02-28 02:23 pm UTC (link)
you mentioned the husband was pretty mean... possibly he abused the dog? it definitely sounds like the dog has been abused, as some submissive behaviour can be expected in a new home, but thats a little ridiculous... she'll probably need to learn to trust humans again

good luck - its probably going to take a lot of time and a lot of patience. shes a beautiful dog, btw

oh, i kind of found you through your icon thing, which i found through one of the communities... so umm. hi. i apologize for my tendency to comment before introductions...

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[info]x_sob
2006-02-28 08:20 pm UTC (link)
that's kind of neat, i'm glad you found me :) And I agree, the husband must have abused her.

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[info]bex_1_dj
2006-03-09 08:09 am UTC (link)
a PUPPPPPPPYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYy hehehe howw cute *hugs it*

his beautiful...dont u hate when people are cruel to animals i hate it :( makes me sad....

ihope all works out and he gets all comfy and stuff :)

im glad his in a good home....

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[info]neke
2006-03-23 01:25 pm UTC (link)
Hi. I put the header you made in the user info of [info]_madonna_stills, since I changed the layout. I hope that's okay.
Also I would like to ask if I could use it as a promo banner in [info]icontest_promo, etcetera. Thanks in advance. :)

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[info]x_sob
2006-03-24 07:08 am UTC (link)
thats fine, and sure :)

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[info]neke
2006-03-24 01:42 pm UTC (link)
Thanks. :)

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[info]bespooked
2006-06-15 01:14 pm UTC (link)
That pisses me off. Poor dog. Urinating accidentally during excitment is more typical for puppies, but an adult dog doing it twice is extreme, that's showing signs of mental abuse. Dogs are like people - they can be mentally abused pretty badly and on the outside look fine, mostly because the owner doesn't physically abuse the dog to the point of noticability.

Poor doggie. I wish you luck. My advice is to start out with very small peices of meat so that she's constantly just a tad hungry and knows where food is coming from. That way she'll come to you. The fact that you're even giving her food directly and not hitting her should help you gain her trust.

What are you planning to do with the dog afterward?

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